For the past twenty years, Rick McCutcheon has helped hundreds of business-to-business businesses improve their sales results. He is the creator of the Full Contact Selling System that allows sales teams to leverage powerful business development strategies through best practice use of technology. Rick has been awarded the prestigious designations of Certified Sales Professional with Distinction and is a five-time recipient of the coveted Microsoft Dynamics MVP award. As a professional speaker and workshop leader, Rick has traveled globally to deliver his practical yet innovative messages on the digital transformation of B2B selling to thousands of business professionals. In this episode, we discuss what exactly Rick does for his clients, how customer service plays a role in the digital transformation of B2B sales, the shocking statistic about how far along in the buying process a business typically is before they reach out to a sales representative, the importance of utilizing LinkedIn as a sales representative, how he helps his clients implement these digital transformations throughout their companies, the future of digital transformation, and more.
Mentioned in this episode:
- Rick McCutcheon’s Website
- Rick McCutcheon on LinkeIn
- Microsoft Dynamics 365
- LinkedIn Sales Navigator
- G2 Crowd
- CRM Evolution Conference
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Transcript
Hey, hey! It’s Andrea and welcome to the Voice of Influence podcast. Today, I have with me Rick McCutcheon. We were both at a conference recently and I was really impressed with Rick, and I’m really excited to have him here today on the podcast.
So, for the past 20 years, Rick has helped hundreds of B2B businesses improve their sales results. He is the creator of the Full Contact Selling system that allows sales teams to leverage powerful business development strategies through best practice use of technology. He has been awarded the prestigious designations of “Certified Sales Professional with Distinction” and is a 5-time recipient of the coveted Microsoft Dynamics MVP Award.
As a professional speaker and workshop leader, he has traveled globally to deliver his practical yet innovative messages on the Digital Transformation of the B2B selling to thousands of business profile professionals.
Andrea: Alright, Rick, it’s great to have you here on the Voice of Influence podcast.
Rick McCutcheon: Thank you, Andrea. It’s my pleasure.
Andrea: So, tell us a little bit about what you do with Full Contact Selling?
Rick McCutcheon: Yeah. It’s interesting because you know, the name of my company is Full Contact Selling and I’ve been doing this for over 20 years, but my company has sort of moved in some different directions over the years. For most of my career, I’ve been in the CRM business, customer relationship management, which is a software category. And I’ve always sort of focused on the sales force automation component.
So, yes, there is a sales training component to what I do but it’s kind of much, much more. We work with organizations and we talk about this digital transformation of selling. We help them understand how to reorganize their sales teams really to, you know, change their processes because customer’s buying processes changed so drastically in B2B over the last 10 years. So we work on the process with them. We take that process and then we look at the technology.
And I specialize in an area, and this is where my MVP is with Microsoft and there’s Dynamics 365, which was formally called Dynamics CRM. So, I specialize in Dynamic CRM, but I also bring in other components like marketing automation. I do a lot of work around LinkedIn, LinkedIn Sales Navigator now to say, “OK, I’m working in the organization. Here’s how we’re gonna, you know, re engineer their sales process to really fit these new socialize buying models and then what do we do with the technology?”
Now the third piece to this is with the people. So, now I’m dealing with a lot of, you know, sales people that have been around for quite a long time or sometimes we’re dealing sort of a younger millennial sales force. How do we now train them to think differently about sort of selling and social selling and contact management in the use of technology so they understand how important these technologies are to the sales process.
Andrea: I know that you spoke recently at this conference about digital experience and customer experience that sort of thing. How does customer experience relate to and why is it such a big deal now in regards to the digital transformation?
Rick McCutcheon: So, you know, we met a few weeks ago at CRM Evolution 2019 in Washington and there are some different components to that; CRM, customer service, call center. And I was speaking in a couple of those categories and it’s a really interesting question you asked because most companies I worked with didn’t start out to reengineer their sales process. They realize they had to reengineer their sales process because the way the customer wanted to be engaged has changed so drastically.
And I specialize in the B2B world. So most people think, “Well, that really hasn’t changed that much.” But that’s not true because B2C, which is the consumer buying completely changed over the last 20 years. You know, we see Amazon coming and really making other retailers up their game. We’re seeing the same thing in B2B because people now want to deal with their supply chain and their different vendors really digitally. They want their own self-serve portals. They want information when they need it. They want to be notified when their products need service, so customers are demanding more from organizations today.
Andrea: Hmm. What are some of the biggest changes then that have taken place do you think?
Rick McCutcheon: The biggest change is really, there was a study done in 2012; IBM was one of the coauthors of the study. And in 2012, they showed in their study that the average buyer in a B2B business was 57 percent through the buying process before they actually reached out to a vendor. And this was true because they could go on the internet and find out everything they need.
Well, other studies had been done since. But in 2016, I talked to somebody at Microsoft, my main partner and my friend was a marketing director there and she said, “Well, we’re probably closer to 70 percent.” So that was 2016. So, I’m thinking we’re now 2019, we’re midyear at this point, how far along the buying process is the customer before they have to reach out to us? And, really, the answer could be 80 percent or more.
Andrea: Wow! So you’re saying that they’ve already done their own research? They’ve already looked at your website and that sort of thing or what other kinds of things are they doing before they even reach out?
Rick McCutcheon: Well, it really means that you know, something triggers internally in that company saying, you know, “We have to go buy a CRM system.” “What do we know about CRM?” They’ll meet as a group. Talk about, you know, “Well, I’ve used sales force. I’ve used sales logics. I’ve used dynamics CRM in the past.” They’ll have a group conversation and then they’ll send a researcher to the web to find out everything they need to know.
They’ll look at which companies should they deal with. They’ll look at which partners they may deal with that have it implemented. They’ll go into user group communities and talk to people who use the product. They’ll go on sites like G2 Crowd and actually look at verified reviews to see how people like the software.
In fact, at the conference, there was a gentleman there speaking from G2 Crowd, and in his presentation he claimed their study show that up to 45 percent of B2B software buyers are now a 100 percent through the buying process before they actually reach out to a vendor.
Andrea: So they’ve already decided
Rick McCutcheon: They’re way down the road and they’re really looking at now who can add more value to me or help, you know, move me through this journey.
Andrea: Interesting. So what do you think that accompanies to have in place in order to be prepared for that kind of, I guess educated or a client that’s taking that much initiative or potential customer that’s taking that much initiative on the front end?
Rick McCutcheon: We’ve got to reorganize our sales teams for one thing, right? So, you know, I don’t want to say cold calling is dead, but it’s limping along pretty badly these days. It’s very difficult to get through on a cold call. It’s almost like we have to learn to influence the customer, influence the prospect, just like your podcast is named.
So, we have to get out there and get the right content to where they’re going to find it to say, “Hey, there is Rick McCutcheon, Full Contact Selling, maybe he can help me with my CRM.” Then they looked at my profile on LinkedIn and say, “Wow, he looks like the Dynamics CRM guy. So, if we’re going with dynamics, he looks like a choice.” But if they were going with sales force, they wouldn’t pick me, right?
So, if you follow my social media and website, I’ve really focused in on that market I’m going after. So, when they’re out searching, they’re going to find me and I think companies have to figure out how to do that and look at who’s my buyer and what journey do they go on when they buy and actually have the things out there to be able to impact them.
And then from a sales rep perspective, they better be very, very, very good on LinkedIn because they’ve got to look good. They’ve got to look like an expert. They’ve got to look like an authority and they’ve got to look like a trusted advisor in their LinkedIn profile to make sure someone’s going to reach out and accept their invitation to LinkedIn.
Andrea: Yeah. That’s a really interesting point. So do you have any specific suggestions about how somebody should utilize their profile on LinkedIn? You said they should look like this. Do you have any suggestions about how they can look like that?
Rick McCutcheon: Well, I’ll give you an example. I did some work in the mining supply area and was up in Northern Canada doing some sessions with a supply group up there. And one fellow’s profile had no picture, spelling errors on it, you know, no real background on their LinkedIn profile. And another person had, you know, the profile was all done with an open pit mine heavy equipment in the background. All the staff had all the mining gear on in their photographs, all their details were about them working in the mining industry.
So, I went to the one guy who actually hired me and I said, “Look at your profile against that profile.” And he said to me, “We’re a better company than they are.” I said, “Yeah.” And I said, “Well, here’s the problem. I’m meeting you guys for the first time and the race has started and you’re not even out of the starting gates than this guy who’s a hundred yards ahead of you.” “He looks like a much better supplier than you do, so now you’ve gotta prove to me that you’re better than this person.” And it all started with maybe, you know, $1,500 investment one company made in their corporate LinkedIn profiles versus somebody who showed they don’t care.
Andrea: That’s very interesting and that’s been something that I’ve paid attention to when working with companies too, how do they show up on LinkedIn and do they even show up on LinkedIn. You can tell the people that have spent a little time on it and you know, invest in that side of things and then people who don’t. It’s also hard I think to convince people that that’s important, but what you just said made a lot of sense.
Do you think that most people really are going to LinkedIn to look up? What percentage of people are going to LinkedIn before they make a buying decision? Any idea?
Rick McCutcheon: I don’t know. Depends on who we talk about, right? If we talk about it in the procurement area, they go to social, right? What social they go to depends, right? So if I’m dealing with a self-service company and I’m doing 80 percent of my profile through self-serve, my purchase through self-serve, I may never get to LinkedIn. I may look at the web, I may look at, you know, Facebook, who knows where I’m going to Pinterest, who knows where I’m going to be pulled into this company.
But as soon as I’m a sales rep and I expose myself and I reach out to you, Andrea and say, “Hey Andrea, I’m Rick McCutcheon from Full Contact Selling, I need to talk to you about your CRM system.” Then bang, they’re coming back to my LinkedIn profile to see if number one, is this a real person or some kind of AI robot reaching out? Or is this spam or do I know this person, or how am I connected to this person?
So, I say, the vast majority of people are going into LinkedIn, but you know, you hit a note there that I find humorous. Like if I go into a company and they don’t believe this is happening, I show them some studies from Google, some studies from IBM. And you know what, if they still don’t think it’s happening, let them hold onto their ideas and let them just drift off into retirement because they’re going to get there very quickly because this B2B process from the buyers’ perspective is changing very, very quickly. And if they can accept that then I can only bring the evidence to them. If they don’t accept the evidence, I just move on.
Andrea: Ok, so you mentioned Sales Navigator. What maybe one or two tips do you have for people in utilizing Sales Navigator to reach out to businesses?
Rick McCutcheon: Your ability to target, right? I do work for some incubators. One fellow built a system for tinnitus, for treatment and it was a hearing system and it was tested at the University of Buffalo. So, we said, “OK, who do we need to go to out there to test it with their patients?” So, we went to audiologist who graduated from the University of Buffalo where the study was done on this device.
And we targeted like 3000 people who fit that category and we found them in minutes in LinkedIn Sales Navigator. In the good old world of selling, there’s no way I could have found them at all and this was instantaneous. So, if I’m a sales rep or any kind of, you know, company business development and I have to target a specific kind of person, the only way I’m going to find them is LinkedIn Sales Navigator.
Andrea: OK, so let’s talk about Microsoft 365 or whenever you’re implementing something like this with a company. I’m assuming that they already know that they want to use a system like this or do you help them figure out what system they should be using or do they already know when they come to you?
Rick McCutcheon: By the time they come to me, they typically know they’re using Dynamics 365. And you know that goes back to my LinkedIn profile. My LinkedIn profile has me as Dynamics 365 guy, right? So if they’re looking at salesforce.com or a NetSuite or another product, when they get to my profile, I’m not the person they’re going to touch and reach out to. I’ve done that on purpose.
Andrea: It filters people.
Rick McCutcheon: Yeah, because people because I want the right people reaching out to me.
Andrea: Sure.
Rick McCutcheon: So, if I was in a situation where some dealers are more of a competitive market, I may end up in that deal early on. But the type of work I’m doing, which is the fine tuning of the product, you know, usually comes after the implementation.
Andrea: What is it? Do you mind just sharing a little bit about the product itself?
Rick McCutcheon: CRM or my product?
Andrea: Yours.
Rick McCutcheon: Well, it’s a methodology, right? So, I’ll start out going through an interview process with the company, understanding what they do, and 99 percent of the time I’m working with senior sales team or senior marketing team. You know, what they do, who’s their target market, how do they service, did they sell direct, or did they sell through a channel? Do they sell through some kind of online direct model to figure out what they’re selling, how they’re selling, look at their process today of what they do, how they manage their accounts.
And over the years, I’ve accumulated hundreds of models that I have in these flow charts. So I go out and say, “OK, here’s the five models we need that fit this company.” We come back, we customize those models for that company and then we come out with a sort of a punch list of, you know, what do we have to do to the CRM system to be able to implement this process. What do we have to do a lot of times for marketing automation and LinkedIn, so what are the things we need to do to make this process flow and then I help them with that project plan.
Andrea: Do you ever find that the people that maybe are on the frontlines that aren’t necessarily working with you directly that they have a hard time implementing the changes that they have been asked to implement when it comes to this new technology that they’re using or these changes that they’ve been made?
Rick McCutcheon: More so in the past. We’re getting so that pretty much everybody who’s still working today is very fairly computer literate. I was doing this back in the 90s. So, back in the 90s, we were working with sales teams with, you know, some completely non-computer users. But you know, pretty much if you’re still in the workforce today, you’re using computers.
You know, getting people to share their information and change their process is probably more of a challenge. And we’re moving away from an independent maverick type sales model where, you know, “Here’s a sales rep and I own my customer.” We’re moving into more of a team selling model where, you know, it’s the marketing of the content, customer service, you know, maybe field service and the sales team really manage that customer together.
Andrea: Yeah. So, when they are doing that or when they’re trying to move toward that, I guess I’m wondering if you ever have any tips for how to help people to understand why it’s so important and why they should do it.
Rick McCutcheon: I’ve got a whole program on user adoption. So yeah, I teach a workshop on it. So you know, the whole user adoption thing is you got to tell them why. You know, figure out why they need to do and get them understand that it’s to their benefit to accumulate this data and to understand their data. You’ve got to get management to manage from the data.
So, you know, if I’m asking my people to use CRM, but I don’t use it myself then there’s a big gap there as well as do I manage from the reports and the dashboards within CRM. So that’s really important giving them as much training and coaching as they need.
You know, the biggest failures I’ve ever seen is when IT department goes and customizes the software and hands it out to the reps and say, “Here’s your software, go use it.” So, we typically put a six-week user adoption program together that includes training coaches, videos, and you know, one-on-one follow-up and this is what I strongly suggest to companies.
Andrea: Yeah, that makes a lot of sense.
Rick McCutcheon: Yes for sure.
Andrea: Yeah. I think that that’s one of the things that can really hold people up and hold the process up when you’re trying to implement something new. I love that you have a whole program that kind of helps them to implement immediately over the course of that six weeks. That’s great!
Rick McCutcheon: I have a good question for you.
Andrea: Yeah, sure.
Rick McCutcheon: Ask me where all this is going in the future.
Andrea: I was just thinking something like that. Yes, I’m totally going to ask that.
Rick McCutcheon: Okay.
Andrea: So where is this digital transformation going in the future? Where are we headed?
Rick McCutcheon: Well, you know, it gets really interesting we start talking about this topic because you know, are we going to be able to operate without sales teams out there? And I don’t believe so. I think, there’s going to be a blending of technology, blending of people’s skills and understanding that conversation and helping people to decide, you know, which solution is better for them.
So, I think, you know, sales professionals are still absolutely needed out in the world even though some techies really kind of are trying to get us to believe it’s all about click, try, and buy, right? We’re finding, it’s really all about more about that relationship, more about trust you’re building with the customer. And I think LinkedIn proves that.
Microsoft bought LinkedIn for $26 billion, I think it was about three years ago now. And, you know, that’s really a social platform where we can connect with other people and communicate with other people and when we need to talk to other people. So, I think there’s proof there that, you know, relationships are still wanted in needed in our culture. So, it’s going to really remain as part of that process.
Andrea: Yes.
Rick McCutcheon: And not give your customers the platform they need and the ability to self-serve when they want; they’re going to go find other suppliers.
Andrea: You know, it kind of makes me think of the old small town kind of selling, you know, and the idea of the people really want to do business with people they know and trust. They still do, even if it’s online.
I look at my dad and he does sales in a small town and those relationships and building into the community and doing things for the community and being out there and having conversations in the community, all of that is now just as relevant. It seems like it’s moved online for the most part, besides the opportunities that people have to connect at conferences and things like that, I suppose.
Rick McCutcheon: And you know what your dad sells in a small town and I’m sure he has a great little business there too, but you know, the world’s a global place. It’s amazing how LinkedIn has allowed us to connect to who we need to connect to no matter where they’re located.
Andrea: Yeah. That’s really cool. Well, Rick, tell us how can listeners get in touch with you or where should they follow you on LinkedIn, obviously. We should be following you on LinkedIn.
Rick McCutcheon:Absolutely. If you go on LinkedIn, you look for Rick McCutcheon, there’s a guy who’ a massive body builder and then there’s the CRM sales process guy. And some people get confused at times, but you’ll see that I’m the sales process CRM fellow. So connect to me and I do lots of webinars, seminars, and events. And hopefully, I can help your audience sort of better understand this world of digital sales transformation.
Andrea: Great! Thank you so much for sharing your expertise with this here at the Voice of Influence podcast.
Rick McCutcheon: Oh, thank you. It’s been my pleasure, Andrea!
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